Official Luthiers Forum!
http://www-.luthiersforum.com/forum/

Feeling like a loser today, and advice?
http://www-.luthiersforum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10102&t=11414		 Page 1 of 2
Author:  Chris Cordle [ Wed Mar 28, 2007 8:05 am ]
Post subject: 
I have decided to name guitar #2 "Recovery" as it has fought me the
entire way...or perhaps it is I who am fighting myself.

Just finished buffing out the finish (Colortone brushing varnish) yesterday.
Had the bridge glued on...looking good! Then I attach the neck and glue
the fretboard extension. All is well and looks good.
I leave it clamped up a couple of hours and remove the clamps....still
looks good. I get up this morning and the fretboard has lifted slightly
revealing a gap. So tonight I get home, heat the fretboard extension and
get it broke loose...thinking to myself "this is easier than I thought it
would be". So I'm removing the neck and it's giving a slight bit of
resistance...when it lets loose somehow the body comes out of my grasp
and flings to the concrete floor
It's almost comical but it hurts to laugh.
Luckily no structural damage but 2 small pock marks or dents and an
inch and a half scratch on the top.
Is there anyone who can save me from myself and offer any tips on
touching up the top?

I searched the archive for dent repair but what I found had more to do
with unfinished wood.

Thanks,
Chris
Author:  CarltonM [ Wed Mar 28, 2007 8:15 am ]
Post subject: 
Ouch! My condolence, Chris. I was just about to PM you and ask how things were going.... It's amazing how things can just leap out of your hands.
Author:  D Stewart [ Wed Mar 28, 2007 8:24 am ]
Post subject: 
No helpful advice other than "you are not alone". We have all suffered from our own stupidity/carelessness/overconfidence, etc. Don't beat yourself up, it's just another learning oportunity. I think most of us can feel your pain.    Good luck with the finishing up. They all have birthmarks afterall don't they?
Author:  Sam Price [ Wed Mar 28, 2007 8:31 am ]
Post subject: 
Take a day's break from anything related with guitar building.

Do something fun, get into the Great Wide Open and get some fresh air.

I don't think Luthiery is fun, it's an intense, attention-seeking hobby that can consume us if we are not careful!! SOOO many elements that can go wrong. It gets us VERY uptight.

I have total respect for you for being so brave to admit your failures. I have seen luthiers (not on this site, because this place contains some of the most HUMBLEST people I have come across online) who will ALWAYS "come across" as extremely successful in whatever they do...you have to assume that their failure rate is pretty high too.

Ahhh, but you NEVER hear about those...."To err is human.. I am very human."

As someone has in their sig,





Remember, some of the greatest luthiers on the planet have made some massive mistakes....how else do you think they learn?

We don't know 'till we try...then if we faff it up, we KNOW NOT what to do next time.

Author:  Sam Price [ Wed Mar 28, 2007 8:33 am ]
Post subject: 
ARGHH!! I need to edit my post..I got "To err is Human..." in the wrong place!!

I'm going to bed.
Author:  Chris Cordle [ Wed Mar 28, 2007 8:48 am ]
Post subject: 
IMG]-28_174651_scratch.jpg">

here's a look at the scratch and the 2 pock marks.
Any advise would be appreciated and highly needed at this point.

Can ya' help a fella down on his luck?
Author:  JJ Donohue [ Wed Mar 28, 2007 8:51 am ]
Post subject: 
Chris...check this out:

The Crash!



The Post-Crash:




I walked away from the disaster for 3 days and then began to think about the repair. David Collins graciously sent me some materials and walked me through the repair. The repair experience that awaits you will make you a better person and luthier. What doesn't kill us makes us stronger.

Post some pics of the damage.
Author:  Chris Cordle [ Wed Mar 28, 2007 8:52 am ]
Post subject: 
It appears the photo uploader is not functioning so I'll try them from my
end.


Author:  Bob Long [ Wed Mar 28, 2007 8:57 am ]
Post subject: 
I know how you feel Chris... I once had a body fall 6 feet onto a concrete floor, when it was still wet with the final coat.

I'm not sure what is the right thing to do. Sanding back to eliminate any damage and then refinishing seems to make the most sense.

Mine landed really hard and I could see a couple of cracks in the binding and one crack in the back. NOW, years later I can see cracks everywhere, in both the top and the back, so... be sure to check carefully for other damage.

Hang in there, Chris

Long
Author:  JJ Donohue [ Wed Mar 28, 2007 9:24 am ]
Post subject: 
Chris...I have a feeling that some of our repair experts will have some great advice on executing an effective repair.

Hang in there, indeed!
Author:  Steve Saville [ Wed Mar 28, 2007 9:48 am ]
Post subject: 
Chris,
My second, third and fourth guitars where much harder to build, with more mistakes than my first.
I feel you pain.
Author:  JBreault [ Wed Mar 28, 2007 10:35 am ]
Post subject: 
Chris, the repaqir guys are conspicuously absent from this discussion. I think you are on your own on this...........














Just kidding. Take a deep breath, let out a sigh, it could've been a lot worse (see JJ's post). I'm sure one of the truly grizzled cets will chime in soon.
Author:  rich altieri [ Wed Mar 28, 2007 11:19 am ]
Post subject: 
Ah heck - that isnt so bad. Last year I did a refinish job in my garage and decided to hang it up to dry on the garage door track and then upon leaving the garage hit the close button and heard this crash!!!!!

Boy, did that ruin my day - and my 000 EI Rosewood side and soundboard. Thought to myself - "They should have a darwin award for wannabe luthiers"

Have dropped guitars, necks, fingerboards and more. Have fine tuned some repair skills as a result. We all have our days.

Author:  Martin Turner [ Wed Mar 28, 2007 11:31 am ]
Post subject: 
Chris,

This is my benchmark for damaged guitars

Author:  novab350 [ Wed Mar 28, 2007 11:36 am ]
Post subject: 

chris,


A couple months ago while trying to get the dovetail joint just right, I had a little accident myself.  The neck was stuck in the joint pretty good and it took a little persuasion to get it out.  When it finally did, I fumbled it around in my hands for a few seconds (it seemed like much longer, like slow motion or something) and then it landed on the soundboard.  A sharp corner on the heel put two large gouges in the soft spruce.  I had to put that one on the shelf and leave it there for awhile.  In fact its still there, I haven't got around to fixing it yet.


I don't have a whole lot of ideas about dealing with dents in finished wood.  It might be possible to puddle some of whatever you were finishing with into the dents/scratches until it was built up to where you could sand/buff it to be smooth and level again.  Just an idea though, you might want a second opinion on doing that.


good luck,


Nate
Author:  Anthony Z [ Wed Mar 28, 2007 11:36 am ]
Post subject: 
Chris -- I wish I had some useful pearls of wisdom to help you fix your guitar. I think most of us have a been there done that experience.

Sam's suggestion is a good place to start though.

Good luck with your repairs and making that baby sing.
Author:  Homeboy [ Wed Mar 28, 2007 11:49 am ]
Post subject: 
Sometimes dents will steam out even under the finish. Go for it. You have nothing to lose.

Blake
Author:  crazymanmichael [ Wed Mar 28, 2007 11:53 am ]
Post subject: 
from the photos the extent of the damage is not clear. if the dent is just in the finish you have to repair the finish. if the wood is dented the heat amd moisture trick will usually swell out the dent, but can cloud or otherwise mar some finishes.

i am not familiar with your brushing lacquer. is it a solvent based nitro? if so your finish repair is fairly straight forward. if it is water based then your finish options are more difficult as trying to recoat the dings will probably leave witness lines. you may have to take the dinged surfaces back to bare wood and refinish.
Author:  crazymanmichael [ Wed Mar 28, 2007 11:58 am ]
Post subject: 
p.s. i know it is painful, but if it is any consolation, consider this: if anyone here hasn't done something similar, after today they have just one less day before they do.
Author:  GregG [ Wed Mar 28, 2007 12:32 pm ]
Post subject: 
Hang in there Chris, it does get easier. My #2 was the guitar from H___, nothing went right, I was finally just about finished when the buffing wheel grabbed the guitar and threw it to the concrete, I stood in amazement for a minute wondering what is happening....there was no structural damage, I just started sanding re-finished and buffed again, turned out to be a Killer sounding and looking guitar, I think yours will as well.

Greg
Author:  Chris Cordle [ Wed Mar 28, 2007 12:49 pm ]
Post subject: 
[QUOTE=crazymanmichael] from the photos the extent of the damage is
not clear. if the dent is just in the finish you have to repair the finish. if
the wood is dented the heat amd moisture trick will usually swell out the
dent, but can cloud or otherwise mar some finishes.

i am not familiar with your brushing lacquer. is it a solvent based nitro? if
so your finish repair is fairly straight forward. if it is water based then
your finish options are more difficult as trying to recoat the dings will
probably leave witness lines. you may have to take the dinged surfaces
back to bare wood and refinish.[/QUOTE]

I believe the damage is limited to the finish.
It is indeed a water based brushing varnish from StewMac.
Can a drop fill with CA glue work with waterbase?
Author:  Chris Cordle [ Wed Mar 28, 2007 12:51 pm ]
Post subject: 
[QUOTE=GregG] Hang in there Chris, it does get easier. My #2 was the
guitar from H___, nothing went right, I was finally just about finished
when the buffing wheel grabbed the guitar and threw it to the concrete, I
stood in amazement for a minute wondering what is happening....there
was no structural damage, I just started sanding re-finished and buffed
again, turned out to be a Killer sounding and looking guitar, I think yours
will as well.

Greg[/QUOTE]

Greg,

Re-doing the top doesn't seem to terrible but I should say that the bridge
is already glued on. Is that going to have to come back off as well?
Author:  Steve Kinnaird [ Wed Mar 28, 2007 2:32 pm ]
Post subject: 
Chris,
I'd call the friendly help line at Stew-Mac and ask your questions. They will be able to advise you on the best technique to fill in the dents on their finish product.

If for some reason that fails...or perhaps you might just want to experiment...you could always put a coat of the finish on scrap, ding the tar out of it, then try different fills/patches. Before long you'll have the best take on what to use, and what looks best.

Oh, by the way, your dents don't look bad at all. And, I can remember the time when with horror, I saw my newly strung-up 12 string go sailing off the table, landing top down on the floor, and sliding/scraping to a vibrant halt. Both it--and I--survived.
So, in a few years you'll look back on this with philosophical poise, if not mild ammusement. And you'll be able to comfort others when it happens to them.

Hang in there,
Steve
Author:  Greg [ Wed Mar 28, 2007 3:27 pm ]
Post subject: 
I've heard a number of times this addage: An apprentce's mistakes show, A journeyman's mistakes do not show and a masters mistakes are part of the unique design of the instrument. I may have the wording incorrect but the sentiment is there. Carry on and someday clients will be clamoring for your "floor modified" guitars.
Page 1 of 2 All times are UTC - 5 hours
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group
http://www.phpbb.com/